From COVID Grad to $8M in 5 Years: How a New Dentist Built a Group Practice with Christmas Cookies and Negotiation Power

What happens when a brand-new dentist graduates in the middle of COVID, can’t find an associateship because everything’s closed, and decides to buy two practices within four months—then turns a million-dollar skeleton practice into a $5M operation after buying it for just $60K? Dr. Rehan Shahid calls himself “the business guy who just happens to be a dentist”—and in five short years since graduating in 2020, he’s built a four-location group practice generating nearly $8M annually, all 100% privately owned with zero private equity involvement. But here’s what makes his story remarkable: he didn’t rely on expensive ad campaigns or fancy marketing firms. Instead, he stood outside with tooth-shaped balloons, delivered Christmas cookies to 25 local businesses with personalized letters (creating instant social media domination), and built relationships with ER departments and cardiologists who needed dental clearances. His mission was simple but powerful: “Be so ridiculously famous in my town that everyone can’t help but know about me.” Now through Practice Success Academy, he’s coaching dentists and their managers together—because he learned that dentists are “lazy people” and “horrible operators” who have amazing ideas but need strong managers to actually implement them. If you’ve ever wondered how to scale without burnout, why coaching the manager is more important than coaching the dentist, or how $100 worth of cookies beats any digital ad campaign, this conversation will completely shift your perspective on growth, systems, and what it really takes to dominate your market.

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Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:

  • 00:00 – Introduction and sponsor shoutout to Marketing 32’s performance guarantee
  • 00:31 – Shoutout to Olivia Smith’s episode on leadership, systems, and dental coaching
  • 01:38 – Meet Dr. Rehan Shahid: Practicing dentist, entrepreneur, and co-CEO of multi-location group
  • 02:04 – Why having clinical dental experience sets Rehan apart from other consultants
  • 02:34 – The COVID graduation story: Everything closed two months after graduating in 2020
  • 02:41 – Buying two practices within four months of graduating dental school
  • 03:01 – Using COVID lockdown time to read books, listen to podcasts, and self-educate on business
  • 03:30 – “I’m the business guy—I just happened to be the dentist”: Not extremely clinical, but loves entrepreneurship
  • 03:46 – Making every mistake possible (and learning from them fast)
  • 03:57 – The mindset: “I’m going to make mistakes to learn—let me make them as fast as I can”
  • 04:24 – Three-year goal: 25 locations from current four offices
  • 04:51 – How coaching emerged from helping struggling dentists who asked for advice
  • 05:08 – Graduating 2020 in the middle of COVID—first day on the job was as an owner, not associate
  • 05:31 – Four offices now: Acquisitions plus one “skeleton startup”
  • 05:45 – 100% owned, no private equity involvement
  • 06:12 – Alliance of Independent Dentists shoutout: Fighting private equity takeover of the industry
  • 06:23 – No associateship opportunity because COVID closed everything
  • 06:31 – Learning dentistry while being an owner, watching YouTube videos, finding mentors to shadow
  • 07:32 – Community marketing strategy: Tooth-shaped balloons and “be so ridiculously famous”
  • 07:59 – The goal: Dominate the community so everyone can’t help but know about you
  • 08:31 – Facebook and Google as fuel on the fire, not the foundation
  • 09:25 – The Christmas cookie strategy: 25 businesses, personalized letters, selfies for social media
  • 09:52 – 25 businesses sharing on their social = dominating the community in one day
  • 10:21 – Thanksgiving pies, ER departments, cardiologists, orthopedic surgeons—strategic relationship building
  • 10:49 – Proactive thinking: How to dominate without going door to door
  • 11:18 – Total cost: $100 for 25 boxes of cookies ($5 per box)—best marketing ever
  • 12:05 – The $60K million-dollar practice story: Buying in hometown after doctor passed away
  • 12:34 – Wife never sold it, practice closed for six months, all patients left
  • 12:56 – Negotiation power: Texas law says you can’t own a practice long without a dentist
  • 13:02 – Million-dollar practice bought for $60K, now a $5M practice
  • 13:51 – Third and fourth locations: Finding practices that need help in sweet-spot financial range
  • 14:26 – The coaching philosophy: Dentists are “lazy people” and “horrible operators”
  • 14:52 – Amazing ideas but poor implementation—that’s why managers matter
  • 15:20 – Coaching both dentist AND manager together—that’s what moves the ball
  • 15:49 – Goal: Buy back dentist’s time, make money, enjoy dentistry while training the manager
  • 16:15 – Black and white success metrics: Everyone knows what winning looks like
  • 16:36 – Engagement tiers: Virtual coaching vs. on-site visits depending on client choice
  • 17:07 – Meeting manager one-on-one without dentist to identify real bottlenecks
  • 17:34 – Being the third-party voice: Respectfully delivering feedback neither side wants to give
  • 17:57 – Biggest challenge: Mindset—people set in their ways need to see the value
  • 18:17 – Selling value like selling dentistry: Show them what’s behind the curtain
  • 19:06 – Walking the walk: Practicing dentist operating multi-group locations
  • 19:34 – “I’ve personally experienced every problem that any dentist has”
  • 20:08 – Tried and tested strategies that grew his company to scale
  • 20:54 – Saturated market advice: What makes you different when there are dentists in your building?
  • 21:38 – Most dentists don’t do community marketing, don’t visit ERs, don’t do holiday outreach
  • 22:06 – The advantage: Most dentists are average—just be above average
  • 22:52 – Template website + $100 on social media = “Where’s my millions?”
  • 23:38 – Scarcity mindset around marketing: “I only have $200/month for a website”
  • 23:47 – Reframing expenses in dental terms: $100 is one filling you do 10x daily
  • 24:15 – Spending a crown’s worth ($1K) on marketing when you do multiple crowns monthly
  • 24:56 – Marketing data: See an ad 6-7 times before making a decision
  • 25:37 – The group practice challenge: Growth happens so fast that middle managers can’t keep up
  • 26:16 – Coaching regional managers to become true operators aligned with organizational vision
  • 27:00 – Emmett Scott and the Dental Entrepreneurial Organization (DEO) reference
  • 27:41 – The golden nugget: “If you’re not measuring it, you’re not managing it”
  • 28:02 – Data-driven decisions: Case acceptance, treatment acceptance, hygiene reappointment rates
  • 28:45 – Most practices don’t know front desk booking rate or why patients aren’t scheduling
  • 29:00 – Call categorization software with AI to expose booking rate gaps

Dr. Rehan Shahid never planned to be an average dentist—he planned to be “the business guy who just happens to be a dentist.” But when he graduated in 2020, COVID had other plans. Two months after graduating, everything closed, eliminating any chance of working as an associate. So he did what any entrepreneurial-minded new grad would do: he bought a practice. Then two months later, he bought another one. Within four months of graduating dental school, he owned two practices and had to learn extremely quickly how to survive and thrive in business. The silver lining of COVID was all the free time it created—time Rehan used to devour books, listen to podcasts, and self-educate on business fundamentals that dental school never taught. His mindset was simple but powerful: “I know I’m going to have to make mistakes to learn. Let me just make them as fast as I can so I can pass that route and move forward.” From day one, he knew he wanted to be a multi-practice owner, and his ambition was to make mistakes rapidly, extract lessons, and scale quickly.

His growth strategy defied conventional wisdom about expensive digital marketing campaigns. Instead of pouring money into Facebook ads and Google PPC, Rehan focused on community domination. He stood outside with tooth-shaped balloons introducing himself as the local dentist. He attended every community event. His mission: “Be so ridiculously famous in my town that everyone can’t help but know about me.” The Christmas cookie strategy became legendary—delivering personalized letters and cookies to 25 local businesses, taking selfies with entire teams, knowing they’d post it on social media. Total cost: $100 for 25 boxes at $5 each. The result: 25 businesses sharing on their social platforms, dominating the community in one day—better ROI than any digital ad campaign. He repeated the strategy with Thanksgiving pies, built relationships with ER departments (who see patients needing dental treatment), and connected with cardiologists and orthopedic surgeons who need dental clearances before procedures. The second practice was a stroke of luck combined with savvy negotiation: a million-dollar practice in his hometown where the doctor passed away, the wife never sold it, and it sat closed for six months until all patients left. Texas law says you can’t own a practice long without a dentist, giving Rehan enormous negotiation power. He bought it for $60K—now it’s a $5M practice.

Through building this four-location group (aiming for 25 in three years, all 100% privately owned with no private equity), Rehan discovered something crucial: dentists are “lazy people” and “horrible operators” with amazing ideas but poor implementation skills. The real key to success isn’t coaching the dentist alone—it’s coaching the dentist AND the manager together. If a practice has a great manager, the dentist flourishes. If the manager isn’t strong, the dentist becomes only as strong as their weakest link. Through Practice Success Academy, Rehan now helps dentists buy back their time and scale by developing managers into true leaders who can implement systems, establish metrics, and drive accountability. He meets managers one-on-one without the dentist present to identify real bottlenecks, then serves as the third-party voice delivering respectful feedback neither side wants to give directly. The biggest challenge is always mindset—people set in their ways who need to see value before buying in, just like patients spending thousands on dentistry they can’t feel or see. For saturated markets where dentists complain about competition, his advice is simple: most dentists are average, doing nothing beyond template websites and minimal social media spending. Just be above average—do the community marketing, visit ERs, deliver holiday gifts to businesses—and you’ll dominate because nobody else is doing it. His golden nugget for all practice owners: “If you’re not measuring it, you’re not managing it.” Track case acceptance, treatment acceptance, hygiene reappointment rates, and front desk booking rates. Make data-driven decisions instead of ad-libbing your way through growth, because that’s how you scale a company successfully without burning out while trying.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Quotable Moments:

“I’m a COVID grad, meaning I graduated during COVID. Two months after graduating, everything was closed. I took advantage of that time and I bought a practice. Two months later, I bought another practice.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I’m the business guy, I just happened to be the dentist. I’m not extremely clinical. I’m the entrepreneur that loves business that happens to do that through dentistry.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I graduated dental school and you don’t know anything on the business side of stuff. You barely know enough to survive being a clinical dentist.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“My ambition was ‘I’m going to be a multi-practice owner from day one, but I knew I got to hurry up and get my reps of experience in so I can make the mistakes, get the lessons, and move fast.'” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I knew I’m going to have to make mistakes to learn. Let me just go make them as fast as I can so I can pass that route and then go forward.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“My first day on the job was me being an owner. I jumped right in and didn’t have a chance to be an associate because everything was closed.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“My goal was just one thing: I want to be so ridiculously famous in my town to where everyone can’t help but know about me. That was the goal—be so famous that people can’t help but know about you.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I went to every single business in my community, maybe 25 businesses, and I gave them Christmas cookies with a personalized letter. Then I took a selfie with the entire business. I knew they were going to post it on their social media.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“When you have 25 businesses sharing on their social, you dominate that community in one day. That’s probably better than any ad you could even think about.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Christmas cookies are like maybe five bucks a pop. I’m spending a hundred dollars basically on 25 boxes of cookies. That’s the best marketing you would ever do.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“The doctor passed away and the owner’s wife never sold it. She waited until every patient left. They closed the whole practice for six months. By the time we ended up getting it, it was no patients, no team—just a skeleton.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“It was a million-dollar practice I bought for 60K. That was like the best investment I’ve ever made in my life. Now it’s a $5 million practice.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Find an office that’s doing okay-ish and just exponentially make it bigger from my systems that I can help scale.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Dentists are lazy people and we’re known to be horrible operators. We have all these amazing ideas, but we don’t get to implement many of them. That goes to the manager.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“You could be an amazing dentist, but if the manager is not great, then you’re as strong as your weakest link.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I started to coach not just the dentist, but also the manager. And that’s what started really turning the wheels and actually getting progress.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Dentists want to go do dentistry and make good money. They don’t want to play a manager when they already have a manager. That’s the manager’s job to manage the office.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“My goal is, how do I help you get your time back, make money, and enjoy the dentistry you’re doing while we actually train the manager to be an office manager with you.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“The first one’s always mindset. Some people are set in their ways and you have to unravel that mindset and show them the value that’s being brought to the table.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Similar to if a patient wants to spend thousands of dollars on dentistry they can’t feel or see and they don’t have any pain, you have to sell them the value. Same thing—to buy your team into what you’re trying to preach, you have to show them the value.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“A lot of consultants—the good thing in our profession is we have a lot of them. The good thing on what I do is we don’t have a lot of consultants that are actually dentists and we barely have any that are actually practicing.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“I like to tell people I get to walk the walk. I’m not only a practicing dentist that operates multi-group locations, but I’m also walking the walk because I get to know exactly what you’re going through because I’ve already been through it or I’m already going through it myself.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Most dentists are average. You just got to be above average and that’s not hard at all. You don’t have to be this executive elite person. You just have to be above average.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“The average dentist only does a template website, maybe puts a hundred bucks on social media, and they’re like ‘Where’s my millions that I’m not making here?’ That’s the average dentist.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“You’ve heard the phrase—you’ve got to spend money to make money. I like to put expenses in the terms of dentistry. If you’re going to spend a hundred bucks, that’s a filling you do 10 of them a day. You shouldn’t complain about that.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Marketing data shows that you have to see an ad probably six to seven times before you actually make a decision. So it’s not like that one $100 you put on Facebook is going to instantly give you a patient.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“The problem with group practices is the growth happens so fast that the middle managers—these regional managers—they don’t get to grow to that level at that same speed. The organization grows quick, the middle managers don’t get to match that, and then they start struggling.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“If you’re not measuring it, you’re not managing it. There’s so much data that exists of what we do, but we as dentists or owners, we just try to go ad-lib and roll with the flow. But that’s not how you scale a company—it’s data-driven decisions.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

“Are you even tracking any data? Case acceptance as a doctor, treatment acceptance, hygiene reappointment rate? If you’re not, then that’s where I’d start. Now it’s not guesswork at that point.” – Dr. Rehan Shahid

Action Steps

  1. Implement the Christmas cookie strategy: Identify 25 local businesses, deliver personalized letters with cookies ($5 each = $100 total), take selfies, leverage their social media
  2. Build ER relationships: Visit emergency rooms within 5-mile radius with referral cards positioning yourself as the dental office they should send patients to
  3. Connect with medical specialists: Reach out to cardiologists and orthopedic surgeons who need dental clearances before procedures
  4. Repeat seasonal outreach: Make Thanksgiving pies, Christmas cookies, and holiday gifts to businesses an annual tradition
  5. Track key metrics immediately: Start measuring case acceptance, treatment acceptance, hygiene reappointment rates, and front desk booking rates

This episode is brought to you by Marketing 32—the only dental marketing team with a performance guarantee where if you’re not growing, you don’t pay. Marketing 32 is truly invested in your growth, helping practices across the spectrum from solo practitioners to 30-location groups acquire new patients and break through growth plateaus. They get patients to your front door through proven digital marketing, SEO, and patient acquisition strategies. But as Dawn reminds us, what happens when patients walk through that door is up to you. If you need help with the marketing side and want to see if you’re a great fit to work together, reach out to Marketing 32 at marketing32.com for a quick discovery conversation.

Episode Transcript:

Brett Allen (00:00)

Hi, Brett Allen here, host of the Marketing 32 show where I connect with leading dentists, dental influencers, and industry experts to uncover the latest strategies, insights, innovations to help your practice grow and thrive. This episode is brought to you always by our team here at Marketing 32. We are the only dental marketing team that I know of that is truly based on performance and value that we deliver. So if you’re not growing, you don’t pay us.

It’s really that simple. We’re truly invested in your growth. If you need help with growth and marketing, check out Marketing32. Scheduled time for us to have a conversation. We’ll set you straight if we can fit together to work together and help you grow. Quick shout out to Olivia Smith. Recently had her on the show. We talked all about her process. She is a dental coach consultant, helping practices to grow through leadership and systems, all of that. If you are in the market for a dental coach, check that episode out.

And also you should pay attention to this episode because I’ve got another inspiring dentist and entrepreneur on the show today. Super excited to welcome Dr. Rehan Shahid. He is a practicing dentist, entrepreneur, and co-CEO of a multi-location dental group, generating over seven million in annual revenue. He ultimately helps dentists buy back their time and scale their practice through coaching.

practice owners on transitioning from operator to CEO by building leadership, systems, and accountability that drive profitability without burnout. I love that. Through Practice Success Academy, he works with dentists and practice owners to buy back their time while scaling sustainable team led businesses. Rayhan, welcome to the show. Excited to have you.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (01:38)

Yeah, thanks Brett, excited to be here.

Brett Allen (01:40)

Yeah, this will be great. A fun conversation. I always love talking to the entrepreneurial minded dentist, the visionary dentist. I know that’s who you are. And I love it that you’re giving back to the industry and working closely one-on-one with dentists to help them. So super excited to have you on the show. Looking forward to our conversation.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (01:57)

Yeah, likewise. ⁓ It’s good to be able to give back in some way to the profession and see it rise over time too.

Brett Allen (02:04)

Yeah. And we need that. I mean, there’s a lot of coaches, consultants out there. And like you said before the show, when we were talking, ⁓ not many of them have the clinical, like the dental experience. And so you, you definitely bring that and I’m excited to dig into your story and your group practice that you’ve built and how you’ve done that and share that with everybody. So let’s, why don’t we start off there? Like, how did you tell us that story? How did you get into dentistry?

and how did you ultimately grow to a group practice? Walk us through that journey.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (02:34)

Yeah, so I’m a COVID grad, meaning for those that don’t know, I graduated during COVID. ⁓ Two months after graduating, everything was closed, it was horrible. I took advantage of that time and I bought a practice. And then two months later from that time, I bought another practice. So, new grad buying two practices within four months of graduating, ⁓ I had to learn pretty quickly how do you actually survive and thrive a business. I got lucky to where…

Brett Allen (02:41)

wow.

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (03:01)

Unfortunately, COVID happened, but the good part of that that came was all the free time I had because you couldn’t everything was closed. So I use that time to read books. I use that time to listen to podcasts, you know, stuff like this that you’re doing Brett listening to podcasts that help drive people forward. And I just got to really educate myself on hey, how do I actually buy a practice? And I knew from day one of dental school, I want to I’m the business guy, I just happened to be the dentist, but I’m known as a guy. I’m not I’m not extremely clinical.

Brett Allen (03:08)

Hmm.

Mmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (03:30)

I’m the entrepreneur that loves business that happens to do that through dentistry. And when I bought the practices, I learned over time what all the mistakes I could have made and I made all of them. And there’s some I still have to make today, but I got to learn so much so quick because I had to. And you graduate dental school and you don’t know anything on the business side of stuff. You barely know enough to survive being a clinical dentist. so through all the lessons I’ve learned from just doing that, I got to

Brett Allen (03:46)

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (03:57)

gained the experience to be able to just start operating. ⁓ and I think that’s what really helped me drive faster was my, my ambition is a, I’m going to be a multi-practice owner from day one, but I knew I got to hurry up and get my reps of experience in so I can make the mistakes, get the lessons and move fast. ⁓ and that was my goal. Hey, I know I’m going to have to make mistakes to learn. Let me just go to make them as fast as I can so I can pass that route and then go forward. that, that

Brett Allen (04:17)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah, I love that.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (04:24)

that got me into that multi-practice ownership and then we bought more practices after that. A three-year goal I have is to get to 25, so we’ll see how that goes. And then just, you in doing that, I started realizing I enjoyed just talking to people and I enjoyed networking and the more dentists I got to meet that were struggling on buying their first practice or they had bought it but they didn’t know how to operate it, I was like, dude, I did, I’ve done that, I’ve made every mistake.

Brett Allen (04:33)

Wow.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (04:51)

Here’s one piece of advice I’ll give you. Here’s a second one. And over time, people just started asking me all these questions and I thought, you know what? I’m actually really enjoying giving back to these people. And that’s where my coaching platform started to arise from.

Brett Allen (05:03)

That’s so awesome. like, so you graduated 2021, is that what you said? 2020, yeah, middle of COVID, right, 2020. So in a short five to six years, you’ve now built a group practice, how many offices again?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (05:08)

2020.

We’re at four offices right now. We just expanded recently. now, and I say 7 million now, we’re probably close to 8 million with all of our expand.

Brett Allen (05:19)

Okay.

Yeah,

that’s incredible. and are these are all through ⁓ &A acquisitions, right? Are they all startup?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (05:31)

Yeah,

acquisitions and then you could say one of them is like a skeleton startup. pretty much, it’s a startup that we just pretty much bought that was very empty. ⁓ And from that, we’re all 100 % owned, no private equity.

Brett Allen (05:40)

Okay.

Awesome, yeah. And I know there’s a growing movement of, especially with the Alliance of Independent Dentists, ⁓ love that group, there’s a growing movement of like how do we prevent private equity and DSOs from coming in and taking over the industry and messing everything up. ⁓ So I love that you’re doing it as privately owned. ⁓ Walk us through that journey a little bit more. So you graduate, were you an associate somewhere or did you just immediately go into?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (06:12)

So because when I graduated during COVID, I didn’t have a chance to be an associate because everything was closed. So my first day on the job was me being an owner.

Brett Allen (06:17)

Okay. Okay. Yeah.

Wow, wow, so you jumped right into it. That’s awesome.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (06:23)

Yeah. So, ⁓ jumped right in

and, know, with, with, with COVID happening, you don’t, we weren’t equipped with a lot of the dental skills either graduating. So, you know, it was just, you know, doing dentistry learning and then trying to watch YouTube videos and really self-educating, ⁓ finding mentors that were dentists and saying, Hey, can I shadow you? Even though I’m already a dentist, because I didn’t get to learn my whole year practically that we got off on.

Brett Allen (06:31)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, so a startup is its own unique beast, especially as a new dentist right out of dental school. We don’t typically work with startup practices. We like to work with practices that are in momentum, have a team, have a patient experience dialed in, have marketing budget that’s where we can just pour gas on the fire, right? I know there’s other marketing companies out there that do work with startups, but

It’s a different beast. And so there’s a lot that you got to learn and there’s a lot that you have to build in order for marketing to really help. ⁓ so I’d love to pick your brain more on like, so how did you grow that first practice? When did you know you wanted a second one? ⁓ What were challenges you faced along the way when you were doing that?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (07:32)

Yeah. So for the first practice, ⁓ how did we market was really just community marketing at that point. You know, I didn’t know how to market, right? Like I said, you don’t get taught that in dental school. There’s not a market class. So it was just going on the community. And we, you know, we had balloons of the shape of a tooth and we would stand with them and say, Hey, we’re the dentist here. Right. We went from like ground marketing to being in every single event. And my goal was just one thing. Hey, I want to be so

Brett Allen (07:41)

Yeah, no, no.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (07:59)

ridiculously famous in my town to where everyone can’t help but know about me. And that was the goal, right? Be just be so famous that people can’t help but know about you. And in that, you know, I dominated the community at that point. And then I started learning, well, you know, Facebook is a thing for marketing, right? Google is a thing for marketing. And then you got to, you know, I got to pay ads and do all the other stuff that people really do. But my biggest return was that just that drive of, hey,

Brett Allen (08:03)

Yes.

Right?

Mm.

Yep.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (08:26)

The goal is being so well known in your community and Facebook and Google and everything else is an avenue of

Brett Allen (08:31)

Yeah, that’s kind of fuel on the fire. When we work with practices and we do ads to target specific kind of patients, it’s an expensive way to acquire patience if you’re not doing it right. Even if you optimize the ad account and get those cost per click down, cost per call down, you’re still paying per call. I’m curious with ground marketing and community events, community outreach, connecting, being everywhere like you said.

Tell us more about how you did that, because that’s always fascinated me since we’re mostly online. All of our team and everything that we do is about building online presence, online community, connecting in Facebook groups, ads, all of that, website reviews. But when you’re on the ground building relationships and the community events, that kind of thing, what did you find worked best? Did you have somebody that kind of ran that and managed it for you, or was that you? Yeah, tell us more.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (09:25)

It was all me. If I wanted to be so well known, I had to show my face out there. And we did things that would propel it forward. for example, during the holiday season of Christmas time, I went to every single business in my community, like maybe 25 businesses, and I gave them Christmas cookies with a personalized letter. And then I took a selfie with the entire business. that was my way of, I knew they were going to post it on their social media.

Brett Allen (09:29)

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (09:52)

So I get their entire following to get to know me and I get to post it on mine. So my entire following knows that I’m serving my community. you know, 25 businesses like that, that’s probably better than any ad you could even think about. all the, and so when you have 25, yeah, when you have 25 businesses sharing on their social, you dominate that community in one day. So that’s like, you know, an example of what I do. And we still do that today. Every Christmas we repeat that. Same thing for Thanksgiving.

Brett Allen (10:04)

⁓ yeah, yeah, just the relationship.

Merry

Dr. Rehan Shahid (10:21)

We give Thanksgiving pies, same thing, pick 25 businesses around. ⁓ We also now go to the emergency rooms because we know they see patients that might need dental treatment. So I want them to know, hey, I’m the dentist that they need to send it to. identifying not only businesses in the community, but just people that can benefit from you as that place that they can refer to. ⁓ Cardiologists, for example, they have to get a medical clearance.

Brett Allen (10:33)

Mm.

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (10:49)

for dental clearance for any procedure that they need to do. I want to be the dentist that comes to their mind when they need to do that. Orthopedic surgeon, same thing. ⁓ And so that’s where it was, I was thinking proactively thinking, how do I dominate my city without going door to door? Well, the easiest answer is tackle the businesses because they’ve already built a relationship with people. And I’m going to play on that and go and go exponentially higher.

Brett Allen (11:04)

Yeah.

I love that. And it doesn’t seem like a high expense activity. mean, there’s time involved to do that and, you know, it takes time to build a relationship and have a conversation with somebody, but you’re not spending a ton to buy a box of cookies and take it to the right.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (11:18)

is

Yeah, Christmas cookies are like maybe five bucks a pop and you know, I’m

spending a hundred dollars basically on 25 boxes of cookies. That’s best marketing you would ever do.

Brett Allen (11:34)

Yeah.

I love that. Yeah, get out of your comfort zone and just go talk to people. ⁓ I love that strategy. That’s great. ⁓ So let’s kind of segue into the next segment of like, okay, so you’re growing these group practices. ⁓ Actually, before we jump into that, when did you know you wanted to open a second location? How did you find that market? ⁓

Dr. Rehan Shahid (11:45)

Yeah.

Brett Allen (12:00)

Or how did you go acquire that practice? What were you looking for? All of that kind of stuff.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (12:05)

So my first practice, ⁓ I bought two months after graduating dental school, the second one that same year, and we kind of lucked into the second one. ⁓ It was in my hometown and I was actually applying to be an associate there. And unfortunately the doctor passed away. And so I lucked into that practice and it was an amazing practice, but it was like a million dollar practice, but the owner’s wife never sold it. And she waited until every patient left.

Brett Allen (12:22)

man.

Mm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (12:34)

They closed the whole practice for like six months. ⁓ And so by the time we ended up getting it, it was like no patients, no team. It was just a skeleton. ⁓ But I was able to buy that practice because I was able to negotiate with her and it was a million dollar practice I bought for 60 K. And that was like the best investment I’ve ever made in my life. Yeah. And now it’s a $5 million practice.

Brett Allen (12:40)

⁓

Yeah, just asset acquisition kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah.

Did you, so obviously there was probably a patient database. You probably had to just reactivate them and like, Hey, this is who we are. Reach out to them, right?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (13:02)

Thank you.

Yeah. So I mean, with that practice, was more of the dentist that passed away. You know, can’t in Texas, you can’t own a practice for a long time without a dentist. And so I had so much negotiation power, um, with her not wanting to have a dentist there until a deal was closed. Every day that they said close was giving me more negotiation power. Um, and then my offer, I’d make one once a month and, I finally, she took my lowest offer and, I’m glad she did.

Brett Allen (13:23)

Hmm.

Yeah, that sounds like a great. Yeah.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (13:32)

I’m buying that and that was a

luck test. My third and fourth was just proactively looking in the Northeast Texas area, the area that I wanted to do my dentistry in. How do I find a practice that’s not extremely successful, but how do I find one that might be needing some help because I can grow that practice. And that is in my sweet spot of a financial range that I’m comfortable with at that time. And so that was my thing. Find an office that’s doing okay-ish and just

Brett Allen (13:51)

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (14:00)

exponentially make it bigger from my systems that I can help scale.

Brett Allen (14:04)

Awesome. Well, let’s kind of go into that component. Now that you work with dentists, teaching kind of your methods and what you’ve learned and experience that you’ve got, tell us more about the, like, how you work with practices, those that are listening that are looking for a dental coach. Yeah, pull back the curtain. Yeah, tell us more.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (14:26)

So

what I realized a long time ago, me as a dentist myself, we dentists are lazy people and we’re known to be horrible operators. What that means is we have all these amazing ideas, but we don’t get to implement many of them. And so really that goes to the manager. If we have a really good manager, then we flourish. You could be an amazing dentist, but if the manager is not great, then you’re, you’re, know, you’re as strong as your weakest link.

Brett Allen (14:33)

He

Dr. Rehan Shahid (14:52)

And so I realized if I want to move the ball, it’s not the dentist only that I have to focus on as the manager. And so that’s where my coaching part comes in. I started to coach not just the dentist, but also the manager. And that’s what started really turning the wheels and actually getting progress. Because at the end of the day, you know, what I do is coaching dentists on how to buy back their time and scale their practice. Dentists want to go do dentistry and then make good money. They don’t want to play a manager when they already have a manager, right? That’s the manager’s job to manage the office.

Brett Allen (14:53)

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (15:20)

And so my goal is, how do I help you get your time back, make money and enjoy dentistry you’re doing while we actually train the manager as a manager office with you. So that way you can actually, you know, reap the benefit of what you signed up for. And so I coach the dentist with their manager and that’s what starts to move the ball. And we do leadership to help the manager become the better leader that the practice needs it to be. and dentists love that they hate, you know, they, they want to tell their manager all this stuff and they just.

are afraid of that conversation. And sometimes having me as a third party person, training that leadership component with that manager makes a huge difference. Focusing on the systems that we need to have in place to help drive what is our expectations. And then just, you know, having metrics so we know what a success actually look like. It’s not a subjective thing that we can sometimes be successful and sometimes not. It’s very black and white, objectively known to everyone in the office knows.

Brett Allen (15:49)

Hmm

Dr. Rehan Shahid (16:15)

What does success look like? What does a day look like that’s considered successful? And what happens based on the metrics if it’s not winning, how do we go and pivot to make it to where we can win again?

Brett Allen (16:25)

Yeah, I love that. how involved and integrated do you get when working with a client? Do you go in person? Do you meet with the team? Or is it all kind of virtual online?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (16:36)

It depends on kind of how much they’ve engaged with me, depending on a tier of coaching that they’ve chosen. I do go on site for some of those that choose that tier with me. ⁓ Some people just like a virtual thing, but my goal is if I can get the, the more engagement I can get, the better the result, right? It’s kind of like taking a CE course virtually is completely different than taking it on site in person. Both of them bring their own value though, but on site is always obviously better because you get to learn more and you make a longer lasting impact.

Brett Allen (16:40)

Okay. Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I can imagine that that’s better. ⁓

Dr. Rehan Shahid (17:07)

Yeah. And I also,

you know, meet the manager one-on-one without the dentist and I get to really focus on them and say, Hey, the dentist is not here. Tell me what your number one, two and three problem is. And here’s what success looks like. What is stopping you from getting there? And I get to hear them as the bottleneck. And if they say, well, my dentist sucks, right? He’s not a good producer. takes too long. Now I have good feedback to work on the dentist and on the opposite, you know, if the dentist is like, my manager is not that great. Well, I get to be the third party and tell the manager that in a respectful way.

Brett Allen (17:11)

Yeah.

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (17:34)

Not saying the dentist says that to you, but hey, this is where I see you lacking. This is what we need to improve. That way can help your dentist improve too.

Brett Allen (17:42)

Yeah, I think that’s great, focusing on the manager and helping them alleviate the bottlenecks. What would you say is kind of like the biggest challenge or bottleneck or inhibitor of growth? In your experience, when you work with clients, what are those?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (17:57)

I think

the first one’s always mindset. Some people are set in their ways and you have to unravel that mindset and ⁓ show them the value that’s being brought to the table. Similar to if a patient wants to thousands of dollars on dentistry, on something that they can’t feel in their mouth or see and they don’t have any pain, you have to sell them the value. You have to show them what that value is and that’s when they buy. Same thing, to buy your team into what you’re trying to preach.

to the mission of what you’re trying to achieve, you have to be able to show them the value, that peak behind the curtain of, this is what we’re aiming for, this is why it’s important, and I can help you actually get there. And then when the team is aligned in that vision, then you move rocks and boulders at that.

Brett Allen (18:36)

Hmm.

Yeah, love that. Do you, you know, there’s many facets, ⁓ areas of the business, right? There’s marketing, there’s finance, there’s insurance, there’s clinical, there’s the team, all of that. What, do you go into all of those areas of the business or are you mostly focused on kind of working directly with the office manager and then helping them kind of, yeah.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (19:06)

Well, a

lot of consultants, the good thing in our profession is we have a lot of them. The good thing on what I do is we don’t have a lot of consultants that are actually dentists and we barely have any that are actually practicing. So I like to tell people I get to walk the walk. I’m not only a practicing dentist that operates a multi practice or multi group locations, but I’m also walking the walk because I get to know exactly what you’re going through because I’ve already been through it or I’m already going through it myself. And so.

Brett Allen (19:17)

Mm.

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (19:34)

When I’m working with a dentist and there’s insurance problems, I know a good amount of what that looks like to be able to say, Hey dude, this is a solution here. Or if I don’t, I’m well connected to people to say, I don’t have the exact solution, but I can connect you to the person that does. And so the, guess that’s what I enjoy. And a lot of my clients enjoy because I’m the practicing dentist and I’m God I’ve personally experienced every problem that any dentist has. And that’s what people love being able to connect to.

Brett Allen (19:43)

Mm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (20:03)

Because if they’re having a marketing problem, you know, I have marketing tips that I’ve done that have made me successful. If they’re having

Brett Allen (20:08)

Mm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (20:09)

a, can’t produce problem, you know, I can talk about what we’ve done. That’s been extremely successful. So they get to get, you know, truly tried and tested things that we’ve done to help grow our company to scale.

Brett Allen (20:19)

That’s great. What would you say? know there’s different consultants out there, especially startup consultants ⁓ and marketing consultants. Every market’s different and the doctor to patient ratio can sometimes play into how competitive a market is and how successful a practice can be. ⁓ Like super saturated markets where it’s hard. ⁓ In your experience, how do you…

How do you help a practice that’s in one of those situations where the market is really saturated? There’s multiple dentists in the same medical building. The doctor-to-patient ratio is lower. I’m trying to figure out, as I work with more more practices, and now we’ve helped over 260 practices to grow, but ⁓ some of them are in markets that are just really tough. So how do you address that?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (21:13)

So the way I help a practice has that complaint of we’re oversaturated. ⁓ There’s dentists across the street. They’re in our same building. I first are asking them, what can you do that makes you different? The good thing in dentistry is most dentists are, like I said, we’re lazy people. Most dentists don’t go and do community marketing. Most dentists don’t go to every single ER within a five mile radius.

Brett Allen (21:17)

Hmm.

Hmm.

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (21:38)

and give them a referral card to say, we want to be the office you need to come to. Right. Most people just don’t do any of that. They don’t do the Christmas holiday thing we talked about. And so you could, you could easily dominate those areas by just determining what does the average dentist do and how do I not be average? Right. And, the mindset of how do I get so ridiculously famous in my community that people can’t help but talk about me or help but know me. And I think we have the advantage that most dentists are average, right?

Brett Allen (21:53)

Mm. Mm.

Mm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (22:06)

You just got to be above average and that’s not hard at all. You don’t have to be this executive elite person. You just have to be above average and with the average and as being average, it’s not hard to out market some.

Brett Allen (22:17)

Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. ⁓ so many dentists, I talk with them and they’re complaining about growth and they’re like, I can’t grow. And then you find out they’re spending, you know, a few hundred dollars a month on marketing, you know, paying for somebody to just host their website. They’ve got some templated brochure website that’s, you know, they’re not running ads. They’re not doing any kind of online engagement, let alone community, ⁓ you know, engagement.

in person, it’s like you hit it on the head. It’s like, what do you, well, what do you, how do you, what do you expect? Right? It’s like, if you’re not growing, then do what others aren’t doing. Yeah. And you’re dying. Yeah. So that’s, that’s typically.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (22:52)

You’re done.

And like you said,

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was going to say, like you said, the average dentist only does a template website, maybe puts a hundred bucks on social media. And they’re like, you where’s my millionaire? Where’s my millions that I’m not making here. And that’s the average dentist, right? You got to spend more to make it.

Brett Allen (23:05)

Right. Yeah.

Yeah, there’s probably, you know, it’s hard. Like you said, we don’t learn business in dental school, let alone anywhere, unless you hire somebody to help walk you through it. And so it’s, you’re going to learn through school hard knocks that, well, if you’re not doing what’s required to move the needle, the noodle is not going to move. So, ⁓ yeah, if you’re, yeah, I think it’s around limiting beliefs, right? It’s like, well, I’ve got all this expense. I’ve got this overhead. I’ve got this team. I’ve got supplies. I’ve got XYZ thing.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (23:37)

It’s my

Brett Allen (23:38)

So then I don’t have, I have this scarcity mindset around, well, I only have so much for marketing, so I’m only gonna pay $200 a month for a website, right? Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (23:47)

Yeah. I

mean, and that’s where, know, it’s like the, you’ve heard the phrase, you guys spend money to make money. And I like to things, I like to put expenses in the terms of dentistry. You know, if you’re to spend a hundred bucks, that’s a filling you do like 10 of them a day, right? You shouldn’t complain about that. Spend a crown worth, right. Which is a thousand bucks or so more now. So when you put it in that terms, it’s like, well, you know what? I actually do multiple crowns in the month. Spending a crown on market, not hard at all now.

Brett Allen (23:53)

Yeah.

Right.

Right.

Yeah.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (24:15)

And when you’re able to put into digestible terms, it kind of sounds crazy. Like, wow, I’ve only spent the cost of a filling, but that marketing effort is so many feelings. Why am I hesitant to spend more?

Brett Allen (24:16)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. if you’re like on average, if you’re spending $150, $200 to acquire a patient with your marketing, okay, so that’s a couple of fillings to get one patient in the door. And we know from data and from the ADA and from marketing studies that on average, the average patient over the lifetime of that patient is anywhere from 10 to 15 to $20,000 of production, let alone…

know, the referrals that they bring in and their family, et cetera. ⁓ definitely.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (24:56)

Yeah, even marketing data

shows that you have to see an ad probably six to seven times before you actually make a decision. So it’s not like that one $100 you put on Facebook is going to instantly give you a pay.

Brett Allen (25:04)

Right?

Yeah.

Yeah, I want to speak more on this. I want to get on more stages and into study clubs to talk about what is effective marketing? What are the costs look like when you’re working with a marketing company? What actually should they be doing? And the questions you should be asking to know if your marketing company and your marketing dollars are working for your practice. So, but that’s a conversation for a whole nother day and we’re almost out of time. This has been

an awesome conversation. We probably should do another one of these and go deeper, yeah, I’m thinking about doing one on group practices and going into the nuances of owning multiple locations and doing a series on that.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (25:37)

Yeah, I’m always down for it.

And it, know, the

group practices bread. one of the things I do, not only do I coach single practice owners, but I also help emerging DSOs or DSOs. And the problem with group practices is the leadership or the growth happens so fast that the middle managers, these regional managers, they don’t get to grow to that level at that same speed. So the practice, the organization grows quick. The middle managers, they don’t get to match that. And then they start struggling.

Brett Allen (25:58)

Mm.

Hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (26:16)

And so that’s where I help coach

them on how do we grow with the practice or with the organization and same concept, right? When I single practices, I’m working with their managers for DSOs or emerging DSOs or group practices. It’s working with the regional managers and developing them into true operators. So that way they can help the vision behind the organization.

Brett Allen (26:23)

Mm.

I love that there’s so much nuance behind every stage of the game, especially if you’re growing a group practice. So I’m sure that that is super valuable. did, had early on in the show, I had Emmett Scott from the DEO on. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the DEO, the Dental Entrepreneurial Organization. Yeah. So great episode. talked about that. Like, when do know you’re ready? ⁓ and where, where does it make sense to actually invest in the practice you’re managing before you.

You know, maybe, maybe we add more ops on before we decide to open another location, but there’s, there’s a lot that goes into group management and, and, and all of that. So yes, we should definitely do another episode and I could pick your brain more on that, but this has been phenomenal. I really enjoyed our time. Look, we’re almost the time has flown by real quick. ⁓ kind of in the format of the show, I always close with this question. Like what’s that one golden nugget, that piece of advice that could have a ripple effect.

that epiphany for our listeners. What would you share?

Dr. Rehan Shahid (27:33)

So one golden nugget that I would share would be, ⁓ there’s a phrase I like to use, if you’re not measuring it, you’re not managing it. And, you know, kind of familiar to what you do, Brett, is there’s so much data that is in existence of what we do, but we as dentists or owners, we just try to go ad-lib and we just try to roll with the flow, but that’s not how you scale a company. It’s data-driven decisions. And that same as marketing, how do you make the next marketing move? Well, you look at the data and see what is it promoting.

Brett Allen (27:41)

Hmm.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (28:02)

How do you light a fire on that and take it more? So for dentists that are listening to this episode, are you even tracking any data? Are you tracking your case acceptance as a doctor, your treatment acceptance, your hygiene reappointment rate? Are you tracking the actual data that moves the ball to make your company successful? Because if you’re not, then that’s where I’d start. Because then you can objectively identify what you actually need to focus on to actually make your company more successful. Now it’s not guesswork at that point.

Brett Allen (28:11)

Hmm

Hmm.

Yeah, I love that. We’re deep in the analytics when we work with practices. A big one I’ll share with you is most practices don’t know the booking rate of their front desk team and when a patient’s not scheduling, why they’re not scheduling. So, ⁓ we have a call cat software we built that has some AI on it. So it really exposes that and helps you see and your team see, okay, what are these different areas that we can improve to that booking rate?

Well, this is phenomenal. I’ve really enjoyed this. It’s probably one of my favorites to record with you, Rehan. Thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing your expertise.

Dr. Rehan Shahid (29:55)

Yeah.

Yeah, thank you so much for having me.

Brett Allen (30:05)

Alright guys, until next time on the Marking32 show, a great rest of your day, great rest of your week, and take care.

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